Mphiwa Nombembe — Entrepreneur, Seeker, Family Man, Passionate about education

Once again, it is what's involved. So good to have you along with us. I love finding interesting people to talk to you and fascinating guests. And tonight's guest is absolutely no different. And we're gonna get into why he is so interesting and fascinating and all of the things he does, who am I talking about? It's Emperor Nombembe. Hello Emperor, how are you? - Hi David, I'm well thanks to yourself. - Good, good, can't complain. So in the lead up to introducing you, I said that you're an exceptionally interesting person and have had, can we say, can we say a colorful, challenging career to date? - Yeah, I think that's a good way to describe it. It's been colorful, exhilarating and challenging and it's grown me exceptionally in the last, call it almost a decade. - Wow, now, before we get into this, full disclosure, I first had it to you on another show that I do, it's actually a podcast called The Education Show, which is where I first came across Emperor. And I was actually blown away by what you do. And I thought, this is the kind of person we need to have on this show and just chatting to us about what he's achieved, why he's achieved it. So let's go right back, Emperor, to the very beginning and talk to me a little bit about who Emperor is and where did you start out, laugh and take us through your journey.

- Happily, happily, David, thank you. So to go right back to the beginning, how far back? (laughing) I was born in, I'm born of my parents in North DC and no wonder, November. And I was born in a small town in KZN called Matatiele. I don't know if you or your listeners, how many of your listeners are aware of that small town. - Believe it or not, I know Matatiele quite well because my late grandfather, they lived there for a while. He was with the railways. - Oh, really, okay. - So you got one person, you know what it is. - Yay. (laughing) - Anyway, back to your story. - And then growing up,

the exciting thing about my upbringing is the amount of movement that my family actually experienced. So having been born in Matatiele, then moved into Durban where I did my early childhood development and soon after that moved to Cape Town for primary school. Soon after that moved to Khabaroni in Botswana where I continued schooling, moved back to Cape Town, moved to Pretoria where I finally finished my schooling. And then, and in all that time, I think that the best thing about it was the challenge and the growing of just being able to adapt, but also enjoying a sense of adventure. I think I discovered a big sense of, a big part of me was the adventurous part of me. So fast forward to varsity years, I elected to do accounting sciences, bachelor's degree in accounting sciences, and that kind of formulated my, let's say the platform for what it is that I do because the skillsets that I picked up there really allowed me to hone in on particular things, things such as the ability for critical thinking. And that was a big one. And that's why I think my parents, my family, also had a big weighting towards me doing, or following a career, at least bachelor's degree in accounting sciences because of that critical thinking that I'd pick up and master from there.

So what that helped me do is then find a way into my early career at Deloitte. And that was in of itself a huge learning experience, a huge learning curve because what I discovered when I started was the chasm between theoretical knowledge of accounting and finance and tax and the like and practical, kind of the practical application thereof

and then also the just reality of being in a working environment. So those early years really, really formulated a resilience in me and most importantly, gave me an opportunity to learn and discover how big the gap really is between schooling and work, which later on and now, which we'll probably get into later in this conversation, but it kind of set the basis and set the scene for what it is that we do now in terms of helping young people really bridge that gap. Then, yeah, so having spent some time at Deloitte, I spent a lot of time kind of honing my skills around processes, running businesses, how do we, 'cause there was a lot of focus in the area that I was in at Deloitte on strategy, innovation and the skill sets that would then help me to actually build or to step out and build businesses that could scale and that could also be impactful in our society. And that was always my goal, to step out at some point and at some point pretty soon because when I was there, my whole focus was really on picking the brains of my seniors and staying as close as possible to them to learn as much as I could and to really sponge and siphon as much as I could from them, both from an experiential point of view, but also from a technical point of view.

And that was really, really, really building for me and that really helped to build a rounding in me that would then set me up to start building the businesses or types of businesses that we're building. Step out of Deloitte, yes. - Sorry, this is the interesting part that I wanna jump into because the first question is, did you always know that you wanted to be an entrepreneur, run your own business or in your case, businesses? - No, David, I didn't. It kind of dawned on me in my first or second year of working that what I want to do really scales beyond me being employed in one field or one industry and working my way through to a retirement age. I really was impacted by my experiences having traveled so much in my youth and impacted by my experiences, having started work and seeing the various needs and gaps in our society that needed to be filled. And so that started to kind of well up in me until it was, I couldn't ignore it anymore. So I didn't always know, but it really began to well up in me in the early days of my working experience where even in one of the first businesses that I started with a mate of mine where we literally designed and tailored suits, we started with our parents and then kind of moved on.

But the way in which we approached it was that, what is the need? So the need may have been at the time, very kind of, I wouldn't call it superficial, but the need was, okay, people need a tire. But then we started looking at what are the various levers that impact this business. So it's a luxury item, et cetera, et cetera. But the vast majority of our society can't afford luxury items. So how do we make luxury items affordable to a broader society? And we started to think about ideas around that and how to create kind of financial incentives for getting involved or being able to then buy into luxury items. And that took me to finance and a very keen interest in finance. And by finance, I mean personal finance, where in the discovery became, how are people living and spending their finances on a daily, weekly, monthly basis? Where does that come from? What is the behavioral kind of science in inverted commas behind that? And how can we start to then redirect people's thinking behavior financially from luxury to necessity,

but without limiting their enjoyment? Because a lot of people think personal finance and they think, oh gosh, now I've got to give up all sorts of things. I've got to give up the things that I like and love. And so we really started thinking about that. And that was always the philosophy in everything we did. Thereafter, so began a career. - Sorry, Impiawa, but I want to just dive a bit more into this clothing business, but let's do that when we come back. My special guest is Impiawa, let me get this right, Impiawa Nombembe. And he is an entrepreneur and I've just got to say, there's a creative brain of note because, and during this conversation, you'll see why I say this, 'cause we're going to jump from clothing to finance, to education and maybe meander of somewhere else in between. We'll be back, this is what's involved. And we're back with my special guest, Impiawa Nombembe. And we're talking about his journey. We're talking about what he's done, what he's doing, what he's going to be doing. And I just find it very exciting and very inspiring. So the clothing business, the making of these bespoke suits, Impiawa, what happened to that? Did you sell it on or did it not work out as well as you wanted it to?

- A big learning from that business was not biting off more than you can chew, because we got so excited in all of the ideas of how to start stretching this business and really making it reach a far greater audience that we lost sight of the very prudent necessities

of business principles. And so eventually the business kind of began to dwindle and eventually we closed it down, we liquidated it. But that was a huge learning. And I speak about it openly because a lot of entrepreneurs that I come into contact with feel like one failure is the end. We almost feel like I have one chance and one chance only. If it fails, that's the end of it. But what we chose to do was to really look at, well, what have we learned from this experience? And so even though the business folded, ultimately the principles were kind of cemented in us and to say that the way we fundamentally run businesses is to look at the greater good and the greater impact. Obviously now we've repositioned ourselves, I've repositioned myself and even future partners to basically look at running businesses not only with the profit line in mind, but also with the impact sphere in mind, but very important not forgetting that they are the basic business principles that it's got to be self-sustaining. So that business unfortunately folded, but we really, really learned a lot from it. And given the opportunity, I would, yeah, I would happily revisit that area because it was quite an exciting time learning what production was like, putting together a production team, putting processes in place, running around, literally running around the streets of Johannesburg, finding all sorts of inputs to production,

everything from fabrics to buttons to thread, it was really thrilling. And so that in a nutshell is kind of the journey

from beginning to really peak and then a decline in our bespoke clothing business, but learning's definitely taken out of that, that is now since applied and used in our current ventures. - Which is something that I find so important and I'm glad that we mentioned this and that's particularly why I asked you about the clothing business is, people, as you rightly say, we're so afraid of failure. And I always remember my mentor always used to say to me, "There is no failure, there's only feedback." And depending on what is your feedback, what can you learn? What can you take away from this? Your learnings that you took away from this led you into finance and the start of your first business there. Talk to me about that one now. - So yes, so the journey and the venture into finance, I spent a bit of time kind of straddling the clothing business and working for a finance, financial services provider, a brokerage. And in that period, I learned about personal finance because we were trying to bring a personal finance element into a luxury environment. And so stepping out of that came the opportunity to formulate and found Vine Private Wealth, which has been a really exciting journey because it's been an opportunity to then hone in on those principles of finance that the seed or the seed for which had been planted earlier on in my journey.

So in formulating Vine Private Wealth, the outlook for Vine Private Wealth was always to equip and empower. And our starting point was how do we equip and empower the young South African professional? Because what we found in our observations, in our research, in our kind of time in this industry spent literally diligently slogging away was that this environment or that grouping of people is very much a sandwich generation where they're supporting themselves, supporting maybe a sibling or two, supporting their parents, supporting a whole host of people, and they begin to drown. So our whole emphasis for Vine Private Wealth is how do we equip the young South African professional to be strengthened not only in the financial kind of output,

but in the knowledge of building a financial and a wealthy future and a prosperous future. So it's helping them understand the nuances, the various levers that impact their lives. And internally, we call them triggers. So basically, what are life's triggers is that people really need to not just know about, but really understand the levers of. A good one, which is something that a lot of people are afraid to speak of, is death, unfortunately. And a lot of people are too afraid to broach the topic because, you know, various personal reasons, but a lot of people are afraid because of the finality of it all as well. But there are so many intricacies that lead people into, and people at mass, into really disastrous financial situations because they were not away, I mean, they're not prepared for the eventuality of somebody in their life passing. So I'll give you a simple example. A parent, a breadwinner perhaps, passes, and a family is left now with not only these kids, the burden of making money, but the underlying impact of not understanding

what the money that was being made was actually, or should actually go towards. And not having been prepared that in the aftermath of somebody passing in their lives, there are so many kind of estate responsibilities that they'll be burdened with. For example, if there's debts left behind, those debts fall on the next of kin. If, you know, and that's one of the heavy burdens, if there's properties in an estate and those properties need to be transferred from one owner to another, perhaps from the deceased to the beneficiaries, there are costs involved there. And a lot of times people aren't aware of those fine intricacies that have a heavy impact if you tally them up. Because if you consider the cost or the burden of estate duty, that often falls on the next of kin because sometimes estates don't have the funds or the liquidity to be able to pay for those taxes. Sometimes the estates don't have the funds or the liquidity to be able to pay for the transfer fees. And so on and so forth. So those are the intricacies that we want to equip and make sure that the young professional and then extension to their kind of sphere of influence and then extended to society at large, those intricacies that people just aren't aware of that make or break their futures after someone passes, then there's all other triggers.

Marriage is a huge trigger. First child, second child, a home, a car, anything you can think of in your life that you plan for has a financial implication. But too often we're not aware of the intricate financial implications. We're aware of, yes, a car costs so much, I have to pay it. But we're not aware of the implications thereafter on the rest of our lives. So that's what Vine Private Law is premised on. It's a wealth of knowledge that we want to give to people and make sure that they understand what decisions and financial decisions they're making. - So am I correct in PEWA, if I understand you, that you're not sort of like a bank that says, you know, private wealth bank, which says, you can only join us if you turn over or not turn over, if you earn a million rand or two million rand a year. Is your concept more of educating? - Absolutely, our concept is primarily pitched or hinged on educating. So in our journey, what we've begun to do now, we've actually formulated a part of the business that now officially focuses on broader society education, free of charge or limited costs in our education. And we literally just trying to get as much education out there as possible. We've got, excuse me, we take our clients on journeys that we call wealth mastery, where we help them understand the intricacies of these various areas of business.

This is now our young professional marketplace. And we take them on these journeys and we help them really understand what it means to make decisions and what these decisions will do in their lives. So it's really premised on educating, educating, educating. - Which is fantastic because one area in our country that, and there are many, but one of the areas is this whole concept of wealth and wealth creation and wealth preservation. And so many of us, I often think, you know what? If the guys had wasted less of my time at school telling me I had to go to sports period or whatever and told me about money, I might've been a bit more prepared in my life because there's just so many pitfalls. And then if you don't know and you don't know what you don't know, that's a huge problem. So I think in terms of what you're doing there, that's absolutely fantastic. We're gonna chat a little bit more about that and then move on to some of the other things that you do, okay? - No problem. - Cool, this is what's involved, my special guest Npewa Nombembe. I think it's fair to call him a serial entrepreneur. We'll be back with more in just a bit. And we're back with my guest, Npewa Nombembe. He is, is your official title, do you have an official title or you just, are you the director, the CEO, the managing director at Vine Private Wealth?

- I am the managing director at Vine Private Wealth, yes. - Ah, okay, but obviously one of the founders as well as the MP. - Yes. - Now, in terms of Vine Private Wealth, that business is up, it's running. You've got it, we're gonna talk some more education stuff, but I'm sure you do more than, 'cause what I wanna move on to as we're gonna wrap up just now, I wanna move on to the actual education platform that you guys have just launched. But before that, there's one or two other things that you do as well, hey? - Yes, so the other kind of major part of my life is a program that is called The Career Mate. That's a big part of my life in conjunction with Vine Private Wealth. It falls under a group of companies called Center View Investment Holdings. And don't be fooled by the name. We don't invest or raise funds for investments. It's a name premised on the tools and the enterprises

that we spend our time and invest our time and hard-earned monies into. So Center View Investment Holdings really is premised on creating an environment or various environments to scale and accelerate learning and the sharing of knowledge. So the premise, again, is in how much can we impact society

by sharing knowledge that we either have or knowledge that we've researched and found and have understood and now can share broadly with a broad audience of people. So that's the other major part of my life and what I'm doing right now, David. - Fantastic, we're gonna get on to Career Mate just now. But just in terms of if we can go back now to Vine Private Wealth. If somebody's listening and they reckon, hey, I could do with some extra education there or I need to get involved. What do we have to do? I mean, do you guys run in-person classes and programs? Is it online? How do we go about connecting there? - So Vine Private Wealth, the easiest way to connect with us is to drop me an email. And if you don't mind, David, I'm happy to share that either now or later in the show with you. - No, let's do the Vine one right now. - Okay, so the easiest way to get in touch with us is to email the firm at vineprivatewealth.com. And so basically, yes, the firm at vineprivatewealth.com. - I'm smiling now because you know the British Royal Family is often referred to as the firm. - I know, it was a bit of an in-house joke when we came up with the title of the firm. So, but yes, we want to, we went with that.

We thought it felt very regal and authoritative at the time. - And also I'm guessing a little onion cheek, a little sort of snub of the nose at the imperial colonialists. So- - I'll say nothing, David. (laughing) The firm at vineprivatewealth.com. And then are people able to then join up with some of your programs there? - Yes, so having emailed the firm, we then contact you in person and we walk you through then a journey of onboarding and really a discovery of who you are, what your needs are and setting out then a plan and a journey that will then get you to where, excuse me, you wanting to be in that plan is involved of wealth mastery. So what areas do you really, based on our assessment with you and our kind of discovery of you, what areas do you need to strengthen in terms of knowledge, but also what areas of your personal and even business life can we now start to impact and implement strategies that will assist you. Whether those strategies are in estate planning or in tax planning or in business planning. As far as field as even brokering products for retail products to form part of your estate. So whether it's life insurance, whether it's investments, we kind of span the entire sphere because all of that still links to you as an individual or you as a family or you as a firm.

So that's kind of the journey that we'll then walk with each individual. And a lot of that information, we like to just make public. So we've got our website as well, which is vineprivatewealth.com. And do we have a bit of information there and insight. And I think pretty soon at the end of this month, in fact, we'll have a very, very sexy revamp of our sites that will then allow people to really, to start engaging with us through that platform as well. And be able to reach us in that way as well. - Wonderful, because I had actually saw a very interesting conversation online the other day, just in terms of estates and planning and worlds, et cetera, et cetera. There's a lot of people who've been investing quite heavily in cryptocurrencies, Bitcoin and the likes thereof. And the question, Rose, was like, okay, so now I've invested in this. I've got this Bitcoin wallet. What happens when I pass away? So that's something I think a lot of the more traditional people haven't even started to think about yet. - No, absolutely. And I mean, that is, those are conversations that really can, one, stretch the mind, but are important to have, because we're not just looking at, you know, your current or your present situation, but what does your future look like?

What is your future, what do your future generations look like and how you setting them up for success? So understanding the full sphere of what's, what's around you as an individual is hugely important. And so that's why these journeys for us with our clients are so impactful and empowering because it's not just looking at what, you know, what do you physically need now? It's how does every trigger around you impact you and impact your pocket and even impact your legacy's pocket? - Yep, absolutely. And it's a subject we could spend hours and hours talking on, I'm sure. - Sorry, David, just a quick one. Sorry, just a really quick one. A fun way to follow these conversations as well as on our social media. We're very active on our social media as Vine Private Wealth. So it's pretty, pretty simple. Whichever social media you go to, if you just search at Vine Private Wealth, you should find us. And we're really active there in sharing and beginning conversations around these various topics. So that's also a nice way to follow what we're talking about and then beginning to engage with us as well. - Brilliant, okey-dokey. My special guest in Piwen on Bembe. And we're talking about Vine Private Wealth now, but we're gonna move on to his next project, which if I've read correctly between the lines is actually a real passion project.

So we're gonna find out what CareerMate is and what it does when we come back. This is what's involved. And we're back, we're wrapping it up with my special guest in Piwen on Bembe. And as I mentioned just before the break, CareerMate. So tell me about CareerMate because I got exceptionally excited about this whole concept and you've just recently launched as well. - So CareerMate is about creating an ecosystem that enables and empowers young people to formulate career journeys. It literally started from a dream. Our co-founder had a literal dream of a desolate land where a seed was planted and roots began. And the key thing is that roots began to grow down and then a tree began to grow and that tree then attracted all sorts of plant life, wildlife and so on and so an ecosystem developed. And so our interpretation of that was basically an ecosystem of knowledge in really closing the gap between the haves and have nots of knowledge and insights into career development and into just basically then life development because CareerMate is really centered on from where I am now, am I achieving what it is that I really, really want to achieve? And am I living the life and am I walking the career path that I really desire to walk?

And most importantly that is suited to me as an individual, me in my state or in my body, in my personality, in my character, am I suited to what it is that I'm doing? And making sure or at least helping young people to wade their way through those uncertainties. So that's what CareerMate is really premised on. And if I can just dive into a bit of detail, it's created and developed as a platform, an online platform that we provide freely to all students. So if you're a seeker, we call them seekers. So if you're a seeker out there in the world, whether you're a scholar, whether you're a student in varsity, whether you're currently working at a job and you feel the itch on the urge to move. If you're a seeker, basically the journey is such that when you go onto careermate.seo.seo.za, you sign up with us and you begin a journey of discovering who you are. And discover who you are simply means beginning to understand what are the levers in you as a person? So what is personality? What makes up my character? How do I interact and engage with others? And you begin to, and we did this with our team. And we all start to begin to realize, oh, so that's why I react like this in situations like that.

That's why I get along with this person more than I do with that person. Because we start to begin, we start to understand the interrelations of each of us. So it's beginning to understand who you are as a person. And what we've built into there is purpose and freedom tracks, we call them. And basically a purpose track is having some idea of who I am, what am I purposed for? What am I designed to do? What is my vision for my life? And what is my vision for society at large? And we challenge young people to start thinking not only within themselves, but to start thinking about just the circle of influence. What is the purpose for which I'm built? And help them just provide them with tools and tricks and kind of insight into unearthing that vision or that purpose for their lives and starting to put some kind of action steps or action plans into place that will then assist them to start walking a purpose led journey. Even though they may be in the situation they're in, or even though they may be in the workplace they're in, or in the schooling environment they're in, it's still, it begins to open up the mind to the possibilities that are out there. Then the freedom track for me is really pulls at the heartstrings because it's about helping young people deal with trauma or begin to understand and identify the traumas that they've experienced in their lives.

And then having identified that, I kind of begin to or equip them to begin to unpack what those traumas are and what those traumas mean and how they impact them in their lives. Because we find that as adults and as we grow and build our careers and our lives, we carry certain baggage with us that impacts our various decisions, big and small. So we're not necessarily trying to be the psychologist for young people. What we're trying to do is alert people to the baggage that they carry and then direct them to how they can now start to deal with that baggage, even in incremental small ways, but it's about progression more so than about perfection. And that's the journey of discovering who you are. And then a whole universe opens up where they now as a seeker, you discover your options. So we've got a library of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of career options. And that's something that as a scholar in the late 90s and the early 2000s, I had no insight into. And a lot of people didn't have insight into it was there are four professions, choose one, my child. For a lot of people that is the reality. And what we've been able to do in the last 18 months, almost 24 months is with our team, being able to really piece together a laundry list of careers, but also importantly the pathways to attaining those designations or those qualifications or just walking the journeys.

And we found that there's multiple ways to becoming a CA. Or for example, there's multiple ways to becoming a doctor, there's multiple. So we also want to kind of have, give young people as a spring of hope that, okay, I didn't, I didn't match lift in high school, but so my world is limited or my world is restricted in terms of what careers I can pursue. But what we're saying is, regardless of where you are now, there is a pathway to get to where you want to be. But taking a step back is to say, the scholar who's starting out and still deciding on what subjects to do, they now have a clear way of making those subject choices and informed choices. And what's really key is how we formulated a way to begin to involve the young person, the young seekers, family or parents or immediate circle of influence in this journey of discovering your options. Because we found that a lot of parents or people who are influential in young scholars' lives have limited insight into what's available out there, what's possible. And so we want them to play a role in understanding the various career options as well. And so that the decision becomes neutral as opposed to a struggle for what I believe versus a struggle for what you believe as the seeker.

- This is what I find so fascinating about what you guys are doing. 'Cause if I think back, and I've got to go back quite a way to my school career, when it got time, I think when is it the end of STEM at seven, I think. You see, I still talk in standards. We had to decide which sort of subjects you were going to take. I didn't get the choice there. I was told, my father said to me, "You will do maths and accounting going forward." And I was like, "But I hate maths and accounting." I was a horrible student, by the way. And yet that's what I got put into. And the expectation from my family in those days was that I become a lawyer, a doctor, an accountant, even a banker. A banker wasn't quite up there, but a banker would have been okay. So they were horrified when I said, but I want to be a radio DJ. But there was not this access. And I mean, as you say now, hundreds of career opportunities, because today, if you think about a lot of our people and in our country, getting a degree in one of those big four, for example, that's seen as a very prestigious thing. And it's seen as a way out of poverty, but it's not necessarily the only way. - Absolutely right, absolutely right. It's not necessarily the only way, yeah.

- So, okay, now you mentioned something earlier on. We are about to run out of time. So I just want to clarify there. If somebody's listening and they've got young people that are either at school or varsity or whatever the case may be, and they want to join the site, how much does it cost? - Well, if you're a seeker, it costs you nothing. So you go into the site, www.careermate.co.za, and you met with a fun landing page. And you literally, there's a bit of information there on the landing page about what the offering is. And you sign up as a student or a seeker. And there you go. The world is open to you to begin really discovering your options, discovering who you are. And beginning to walk the journey of filling your bucket of knowledge as you go through school or varsity, or even the workplace, if you are in a position to switch.

- Okay, so literally you go there as a young person, log in, sign up, and you start your journey. And this is amazing, and it can do amazing things. Now, the actual platform launched, what about two weeks ago, a week ago? - The platform launched two weeks ago. Yeah, the 23rd of April, it launched. To great fanfare and excitement in our team. And so now we are, yeah, we're anxiously watching the platform as it grows and making sure that everything works the way it's supposed to and so on and so forth. So yeah, the platform is there, it's available, it's out in the open, and young people can join. What we have done quite deliberately as a team is to go out to schools, particularly in underserved areas, and begin to talk about the career-made two-school principles. And we've actually had some schools reach out to us since we've launched, where we then kind of present to the school this very option and opportunity. And it's gone down an absolute, absolute winner for the schools, especially because it's available to the schooling population at no cost. So it really adds no pressure to them. So what we're liking to do and what we're doing quite deliberately as a team is going out and really encouraging schools to get their schools on, because what we've done is we've created a real estate for the school, where we create a school page on the site, they share their story, they share their challenges.

And what we're looking to do with that is to really galvanize support behind the schools as well and helping them in fulfilling whatever endeavors that they're trying to fulfill in serving their school population and the communities in which they're based. - Fantastic. It is, once again, if you've been listening and you're going, what careermate.co.za, if you've got young people that are at school, or if they are in varsity, maybe in metric this year, whatever the case may be, this is the place to go, okay? I've checked it out. It is absolutely brilliant. I'm assuming that you guys are happy with the adoption rate so far. - So far so good. We're happy with the adoption rate, but our view is everybody needs to have access to this. So we really want as many people out there to really start engaging with the platform and start forging career paths that maybe they never even thought existed. - Wonderful stuff. Before I let you go, Empiawe, 'cause I know you've no doubt got a lot to do, knowing that your love for business and creating businesses, what's next for Empiawe Nombembe? - What's next for Empiawe Nombembe? Wow. And there's definitely a lot in the works. So there's a foundation that our family has founded and there's a lot of work that we're doing there to broaden kind of our impact into South African society.

So there's, yeah, watch the space. There may be some farming involved. There may be all sorts of things, but it's gonna be adventurous as my life story would suggest. And it's gonna be creative because I believe there's a lot of solutions out there that we can really begin to plow into people's lives that are creative. So even if it is agricultural or even if it is more educational, more finance, there's definitely a lot out there that is in the works. - Wonderful stuff. I knew there would be. It wraps it up for this edition of "What's Involved?" Me and Tom Flarsbaugh, when you're having fun. That was my special guest, Empiawe Nombembe. He is the Managing Director of Vine Private Wealth. So remember that again. If you wanna get all of them there, it's the firm at vineprivatewealth.com. Otherwise, go and check out careermate.co.za. As I said, wraps it up for us. We'll be back with some more "What's Involved?" To each and every one of you, thank you for listening. Look after yourselves. Take care.